Miss Anderson, but which one?
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Where: Waterford, Ireland
Try to find the spot where the photographer was standing.
When: 01 September 1907
Try to find the date or year when this image was made.
Just love this one! Everything seems so glossy and shiny - the horses' coats, their hooves - even the windows are gleaming.
Very smartly turned out in their riding gear are these two young ladies at Grace Dieu Lodge, Clogheen, Co. Waterford. We had this photograph titled as the Misses Anderson, but from all the research below, it looks as if there was only one Miss Anderson connected with Grace Dieu Lodge at this time - Miss Susan Alice Anderson (1881-1941), who would have been about 26 when this photo was taken.
Date: Early September 1907
NLI Ref: POOLEWP 1685
You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie
Source: Flickr Commons
Views: 164074
Very smartly turned out in their riding gear are these two young ladies at Grace Dieu Lodge, Clogheen, Co. Waterford. We had this photograph titled as the Misses Anderson, but from all the research below, it looks as if there was only one Miss Anderson connected with Grace Dieu Lodge at this time - Miss Susan Alice Anderson (1881-1941), who would have been about 26 when this photo was taken.
Date: Early September 1907
NLI Ref: POOLEWP 1685
You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie
Info:
Owner: National Library of Ireland on The CommonsSource: Flickr Commons
Views: 164074
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John Spooner
sorry to kick this off on a sombre note - Times (London) deaths Dec 22nd 1941: ANDERSON Dec 19th 1941, at her residence Grace Dieu Manor, Waterford, SUSAN ALICE, daughter of the late T. W. ANDERSON, DL
Swordscookie
All the hallmarks of privilege and wealth and yet a very handsome pair of pairs. Lovely photograph and an excellent composition.
Swordscookie
From the NUIG site: "In the 1870s Thomas William Anderson of Grace Dieu Lodge, county Waterford, owned 836 acres in county Cork, 600 acres in county Waterford and 1,704 acres in county Kilkenny." and "This house is labelled on the 25-inch Ordnance Survey map of the 1890s as Grace Dieu. In 1848 it was leased by James Anderson from the Carew estate and valued at almost £49. It is still extant and run as a retreat centre by a religious order."
John Spooner
This says that Susan Alice was the only daughter of TW, so who is the other Miss Anderson? A cousin?
heady school
In the 1901 census, Susan Anderson was 20, born in Kilkenny, and a scholar. Her father was 48, widowed, and listed his occupation as "Interest of Money". Nice one. By the 1911 census he was a magistrate and had remarried. Ellen Carew from Limerick, was the new Mrs. Anderson. Three years married. Susan Alice was still single.
John Spooner
Susan Alice was born in 1881, and her mother ( Constance Agnes Jane Kirwan) died in October 1881 (in childbirth?), Her father Thomas William Anderson married his wife's sister ( Ellen Blanche Carew Blacker Kirwan) on Oct 2nd 1907 - about a month after this picture was taken.
Swordscookie
I found the following on Google from Ancestry.com Dublin, 6 Dec. Births. A few days ago, at Grace Dieu, near Waterford, the wife of James Anderson, Esq; of a son. Susanna, dau. of Christmas Paul M.P., of Paulville, co. Carlow. S. of Alexander A. of Gracedieu; 'Anderson', BIFR. Joshua A. of Gracedieu, James's 4th son. What really amused me though was the following:- "Married. Mr. Thomas Robinson, of Clonegall, in the county of Carlow, aged 90, to the amiable Miss Behane of said place, whose smallest accomplishment is a fortune of £1,000." With a fortune of a grand being amiable is not really necessary but a "nice to have?" But to a 90 year old? Did he reckon that he would live long enough to spend it on her???
John Spooner
The only other Misses Anderson I can find on the immediate family tree are an aunt who would have been 57 at the time of the photo and a cousin who would have been 13.
heady school
Some more information on Thomas William Anderson. Thomas William Anderson (son of James Anderson and Margaret Carew) was born 26 Jun 1852, and died 05 Sep 1925 in Gracedieu,Waterford. He married (1) Constance Agnes Jane Kirwan on 10 Nov 1879 in London, daughter of Anthony LaTouche Kirwan and Susan Blacker. He married (2) Ellen Blanche Carew Blacker Kirwan on 02 Oct 1907 in London. He is buried at Abbey Churchyard, Kilculliheen, Ferrybank, Waterford.
heady school
[http://www.flickr.com/photos/johnspooner] Constance Agnes Jane Kirwan, or Mrs. Anderson, Susan's mother, died on the 19th August 1881, in Bellevue, Waterford. Her funeral was reported in the Limerick Chronicle of 25th August 1881. Death of Mrs Anderson. Limerick Chronicle 25 Aug 1881. Much regret, the Clone Chronicle says, is felt at the death, at the early age of 23 years of Mrs T W Anderson, of Bellevue, near this city. Constance Agnes Jane Anderson was daughter of the late Very Rev Dean La Touche Kirwan, of Limerick. The coffin, placed on a hearse drawn by four horses, left Bellevue at half-past twelve yesterday (Tuesday) and was followed to the Abbey Churchyard by an immense gathering of relatives and friends of the deceased, the carriages of the principal families of the counties of Kilkenny and Waterford being in attendance. The chief mourners were - Thomas W Anderson, Esq, JP (husband of the deceased), A C Anderson, Esq, J W Kirwan, Esq, and the Misses Kirwan (brother and sisters of the deceased), Paul Anderson, Esq, Dr Anderson, C N Bolton, Esq, Sir R J Paul, Bart, DL,W J Paul Esq, RM, R. Paul, Esq, R F Carew, Esq, DL, R H Anderson, Esq, Rev Canon Blacker, &c. The impressive funeral service was read by the Rev W Gilmor.At the conclusion the Dead March was played on the organ and the remains were borne to the vault by the tenantry (about a 100 of whom were present), who evinced the deepest regret for the loss of one who was loved by all who enjoyed the pleasure of her acquaintance. Burial: 1881, Abbey Churchyard, Kilculliheen, Ferrybank, Waterford.
guliolopez
As swordscookie mentioned it seems like the Sacred Heart Missionaries ran a retreat at the manor for some years, but it closed in 2011, and they sought "caretaker" residents to occupy the place
heady school
Thomas William Anderson was born on 26th June 1852, and died on 5th September 1925 at age 73. He graduated from Cambridge University, Cambridge, Cambridgeshire, England, with a Bachelor of Arts (B.A.). He held the office of High Sheriff of County Waterford in 1885. He held the office of Deputy Lieutenant (D.L.) of County Waterford. He held the office of Justice of the Peace (J.P.) for County Waterford. He held the office of Justice of the Peace (J.P.) for County Kilkenny.
Niall McAuley
GeoHive OS 25" link
ɹǝqɯoɔɥɔɐǝq
[http://www.flickr.com/photos/eyelightfilms] His father James with a prize bull (!) in 1863 - www.gettyimages.com.au/detail/news-photo/james-anderson-o...
heady school
Maybe off on a tangent or two here, but Getty Images have a photo of James Anderson of Grace Dieu Lodge with his prize bull, 'The Rose of the Suir', winner of the 1st Prize at the Waterford Show in 1863, and, on another diversion, I found the grave of a Noel Morris Anderson of Grace Dieu, who died in India in 1940.
Niall McAuley
The MARC notes at the nli archive describe this as Miss Anderson, Gracediew Lodge, group on horses Perhaps only one of the ladies is Miss Anderson.
heady school
http://www.flickr.com/photos/beachcomberaustralia Doh! Beat me to it.
DannyM8
http://www.flickr.com/photos/petguidenz/5593700353/in/photostream/
guliolopez
All important Google Maps link. (With a Bing Maps one just for impartiality).
Swordscookie
http://www.flickr.com/photos/79549245@N06 Is that TW himself?
ccferrie
Grace Dieu originally built c 1840, remodelled 1892-94 by Albert Edward Murray www.dia.ie/works/view/12211 It was featured in the Irish Builder at the time of the remodelling sources.nli.ie/Record/PS_UR_072581
DannyM8
http://www.flickr.com/photos/swordscookie T. W. looking out the gleaming window at the two wans on the horses, and Thinking.......... http://www.flickr.com/photos/boston_public_library/5635031698/
ccferrie
Here's a contemporary photo of the same part of the building
heady school
http://www.flickr.com/photos/77199267@N03 Something not quite right about the look of the house in the recent photo. That paint job doesn't work for a start. Are those PVC windows? There really should be in a darker colour.
Swordscookie
http://www.flickr.com/photos/79549245@N06 TW was a man after your own heart Danny. Just to add a little colour to the proceedings what do you think he would have said about this? http://www.flickr.com/photos/24744732@N03/4596239865/
DannyM8
http://www.flickr.com/photos/swordscookie no comment http://www.flickr.com/photos/69811923@N00/2969522034/
heady school
Shameless self-promotion. My grandmother in a similar outfit to Miss Anderson.
ccferrie
http://www.flickr.com/photos/eyelightfilms They are PVC windows - the conservatory add-on is also more recent. I'm not sure the pebble-dash finish would have been there originally and you're right, the colours are all wrong.
blackpoolbeach
The choker fashion was inspired by Princess Alexandra, later Queen Alexandra. "She hid a small scar on her neck, which was likely the result of a childhood operation, by wearing choker necklaces and high necklines, setting fashions which were adopted for fifty years." en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexandra_of_Denmark
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
Didn't mean to mislead with the "Misses Anderson", but that's how this one was titled in our Power and Privilege photographic exhibition a couple of years back. I had assumed (perhaps wrongly) that further research had been done showing that they were both Andersons...
DannyM8
http://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley Niall - I see on the OSI 25 that the house has an associated Reservoir, tank, pump and a hydraulic ram. What would this be used for?
Frank Fullard
Delightful reminder of times gone by!
Niall McAuley
A hydraulic ram is a machine with no moving parts, excepting two working valves and sometimes one air valve, and is used for raising a portion of the water which works it to a height, such as from a valley to a cistern in a house or a reservoir or water tower in some elevated position. Apparently.
Swordscookie
http://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley I remember just such a ram outiside the house that stood where Sean Quinn built his Slieve Russel hotel between Belturbet and Ballyconnell in Co. Cavan. The house there was owned by Arthur Ennis the seed and feed merchants and that ram worked away there for years filling a tank from a well/spring down below it!
Angelo Nori
Very nice !!
DannyM8
http://www.flickr.com/photos/26503237@N08/3099334881/
Swordscookie
http://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley http://www.flickr.com/photos/79549245@N06 Got these on Flickr and they give some idea of what a ram looks like and how it works. http://www.flickr.com/photos/68888883@N00/437019376/ and http://www.flickr.com/photos/68888883@N00/337495769/
DannyM8
http://www.flickr.com/photos/swordscookie http://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauleyThank you
Swordscookie
http://www.flickr.com/photos/79549245@N06 Just sorry there was no dog in these either:-(
DannyM8
http://www.flickr.com/photos/swordscookie It is beyond a joke now...... "She who passes very quickly by any photograph of a dog in the Archive" or http://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland for short is beginning to get to me. If there is no dog within the next 24 hours further action will be taken..... http://www.flickr.com/photos/14135272@N00/411807706/
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
http://www.flickr.com/photos/79549245@N06 No dogs until the New Year!
DannyM8
http://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland Not Happy
Swordscookie
http://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland Not fair!
blackpoolbeach
Google Translation Hydraulic Ram = Water Goat
Swordscookie
http://www.flickr.com/photos/blackpoolbeach Google doesn't know its sheep from goats then;-)
desmondg47
As far as I know, the hydraulic ram on Anderson's land is part of the mill race of Ballindud which operates the water wheel owned by the griffin Family there. Its one of the oldest mill races in the country and the researches of the late Dr Niall Byrne showed that it the property in early mediaeval times of the Knights Templar or Hospitallers.
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
http://www.flickr.com/photos/johnspooner http://www.flickr.com/photos/swordscookie http://www.flickr.com/photos/eyelightfilms Hold on, chaps! Just spotted some contradictions in your information. We have a couple of death dates for Susan's mother, Constance: August and October 1881, and a birth date from Ancestry of 6 December. Whichever month Constance sadly died, Susan could not have been born on 6 December...
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
http://www.flickr.com/photos/frankfullard It is indeed, Frank.
fainomenon
Miss Anderson is on the left
Niall McAuley
This archive shot is of Miss Anderson and her father on horseback - I think she is the one on our right in this image (with the dark collar on her jacket).
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
I have just added this photo to our 50,000+ Views album. https://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland/sets/72157651136879037