Armoured Car, Passage West, Cork

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Research Help!

Where: Cork, Ireland

Try to find the spot where the photographer was standing.

When: 01 August 1922

Try to find the date or year when this image was made.
Thanks to everyone for helping with this photo that started life in our catalogue with very sketchy information! All we knew was that it was an armoured car in Cork, ca. 1922, and that the photo was taken by W.D. Hogan....

We now know:
•It’s a Peerless Armoured Car, one of two that was used in the seaborne attack on Cork during the Irish Civil War in early August 1922
•There was a delay in taking the two armoured cars off the ship as the Peerless weighed 6 tons, and was too heavy for the crane. They had to wait till the tide was at a level where the deck of the ship was in line with the dock. The armoured car was then dragged off the ship
•The troops were National Army soldiers
•There is a restored Peerless armoured car in the Curragh Army Base
•The photo appeared in the Sunday Independent on 13 August 1922
•The photo was taken opposite the post office at the corners of Strand Street / Railway Street / Main Street in Passage West, Co. Cork
•The business with the gable wall here was owned by P.J. Fitzgerald who lived above the shop. Fitzgeralds was a boot & shoe warehouse / drapers / grocers / insurance agent / pawnbrokers / provision dealers

Can't quite make out the grafitti on the wall that urges Corkonians to "Join the ..." or the letters on the car's registration no. followed by either 137, 237, or 737?

This photo was uploaded at the request of vintary, one of our contacts who knew that he had information on the image. See all of the comments below for how the story behind the photo unfolded...

This photo appeared in the Sunday Independent on 13 August 1922, with the caption:
"A Dangerous Corner - This photograph was taken in one of the towns captured during the past week by the National Army. It shows an amoured car "manoeuvring for position" at the end of a street facing the post office. Irregulars occupy the further end of the street, and are being quickly dislodged by infantry supported by the armoured car."

Date: 8/9 August 1922?

NLI Ref.: HOG6

Info:

Owner: National Library of Ireland on The Commons
Source: Flickr Commons
Views: 67503
irishcivilwar armouredcar nationalarmy freestate troops soldiers streetfighting cork ireland munster fitzgerald housefurnishers provisionmerchants posters pistol august 1922 1920s twenties peerless britishtankcorps sunburst crest passagewest passagewestpostoffice hogancollection armoredcar nationallibraryofireland williamdavidhogan wdhogan

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  • profile

    Wendy:

    • 07/Jan/2012 13:52:16

    someone about to be run over! (see DUBLYN!!)

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 07/Jan/2012 14:13:22

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/lizinitaly DUBLYN?

  • profile

    Flapweb

    • 07/Jan/2012 15:16:42

    Excellent piece of history.

  • profile

    maorlando - God keeps me as I lean on Him!!

    • 07/Jan/2012 18:56:30

    Amazing... great vintage photo!!!

  • profile

    Khnum-hotep

    • 07/Jan/2012 19:07:48

    Cork. I wonder if this is the back of the Court House on the right, looking towards Washington Street. The photographer would then have his back to St Francis Liberty Street.

  • profile

    artland

    • 08/Jan/2012 00:13:37

    Congratulations! This is a wonderful shot! You are invited to post it to: artland

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 08/Jan/2012 13:39:42

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/khnumhotep Thank you. Had a good scout around on Google Maps at the location you mention, but I'm not seeing too many points in common. Would that be changes to streetscape since 1922? Hoping that once Vintary weighs in with information, we'll have a definite location...

  • profile

    blackpoolbeach

    • 08/Jan/2012 14:45:21

    This looks like a Peerless Armoured Car with solid tyres. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peerless_Armoured_Car The soldier touching the ground is holding a pistol in his right hand. On the left of the photo is "-- West Post Office".

  • profile

    gamy hydrant

    • 08/Jan/2012 14:59:49

    I have no idea of the exact location. The image appeared in the Sunday Independent newspaper 13/08/1922 and was titled “street fighting in Cork”. The armoured car is a National army Peerless armoured car, and was one of two that was used in the landings in Cork early August 1922. There was a delay in taking the cars of the ship as the Peerless been 6ton was too heavy for the crane. They had to wait till the tide was right with the deck in line with the dock. The car then was drag off with the crane just taking the weight. You have an image of that in your archive HOG16,, There is a restored Peerless in the Irish army camp at the Curragh Co Kildare. catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000218867 Curragh camp www.flickr.com/photos/vintary/

  • profile

    blackpoolbeach

    • 08/Jan/2012 15:20:26

    How about Passage West Post Office? Buildings on the left have gone and the gable end on the right has been built over, but the wee window high up on the left gable end is still there. The Post Office has moved to the Gala shop. maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=passage+west+post+office+cork+ir...

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 08/Jan/2012 15:34:07

    Thanks a million http://www.flickr.com/photos/vintary! Will check out the Sunday Independent and if there's any other info. in the news pages, will add it here. Love the delay while waiting for the tide story, and now I can add your information to our catalogue record for image HOG6...

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 08/Jan/2012 15:41:50

    Taking all your points on board [http://www.flickr.com/photos/blackpoolbeach], it really could be here! This is what the Wikipedia article on Passage West has to say: "Passage West saw a large scale landing of Free State (pro-treaty) troops on the 2nd of August 1922 as part of a wider offensive. These 1,500 men, well equipped with artillery and armour supplied by the British, went on to capture Cork city from the badly armed republican troops who were holding it." So, will I go ahead and locate this image on this spot then??

  • profile

    gamy hydrant

    • 08/Jan/2012 15:49:14

    There is another image in your archive (Cant find it just now) which shows the Peerless on board ship with the reg H 137. H 137 in a British army reg, there were over 70 Peerless serving in Ireland with the British forces, many of them would have had a similer reg. The car above still has its British TANK CORPS badge on the chassis with the Irish National army sunburst crest on the side. most of the landings in Cork were at Passage west

  • profile

    blackpoolbeach

    • 08/Jan/2012 15:50:18

    Sorry the Google link broke when I was editing my post, but it is OK now. The view is looking down Strand Street towards Main Street, Passage West. The gable end on the right could be Railway Street. The photographer is standing well back from the action, thus creating the telephoto effect. Google Street View is amazing.

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 08/Jan/2012 16:09:00

    [http://www.flickr.com/photos/vintary] Is this the one? Can't see the H, but it looks like 137.

  • profile

    blackpoolbeach

    • 08/Jan/2012 16:11:54

    Here is the old Passage West Post Office, now Dunlea Mulpeter & Co, Solicitors. maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=passage+west+post+office+cork+ir...

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 08/Jan/2012 16:15:32

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/blackpoolbeach Thanks for all your help! And yes, Street View is amazing. Have added location now. You might have a glance at it please, and see if it's relatively spot on?

  • profile

    blackpoolbeach

    • 08/Jan/2012 16:30:11

    Location was probably a few metres further south, where Tom Fahy Park is now. maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=passage+west+post+office+cork+ir...

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 08/Jan/2012 16:49:10

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/blackpoolbeach Thanks!

  • profile

    gamy hydrant

    • 08/Jan/2012 16:59:16

    Sorry it was not one of your's and it was H 337 not 137 www.flickr.com/photos/vintary/?saved=1

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 08/Jan/2012 17:26:16

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/vintary Ah well.

  • profile

    blackpoolbeach

    • 08/Jan/2012 17:26:17

    Have just found the location on Ordnance Survey Ireland, Historic Maps. A very useful free website. maps.osi.ie/publicviewer/#V1,576946,568728,7,9

  • profile

    BlueisCoool

    • 09/Jan/2012 02:13:49

    Very interesting capture - congrats !

  • profile

    guliolopez

    • 10/Jan/2012 12:10:07

    Would say the coords/location on this are pretty accurate now. (Kudos to blackpoolbeach for recognising the post office sign). The most prominent gable (building on righthand-side which soldiers appear to be taking shelter against) seems to be that of Fitzgeralds Provision Merchants. Guy's almanac of 1921 puts a merchant called "P Fitzgerald" on Strand Street. The listing(s) refer to Fitzgerald's as (amongst other things) Provision Dealers, Drapers, and Pawnbrokers. I'd therefore say it's a safe bet that that's the right premises and map coords. Two other interesting things about the Fitzgerald's premises. First is the intruiging poster. Which seems to show two maps of Ireland. One of which is covered by the union flag. The other of which is not. Would love to see a hi-res of that poster to understand the message. The other intriguing thing is how/where the soldiers appear to be taking cover. The position of the soldiers outside Fitzgerald's and the orientation of the Peerless car seems to suggest that there is something dangerous "off camera" to the right. However to the right of that photo (no more than about ~200 feet) is the water front. (The eponymous "strand" of Strand Street). If the pro-treaty forces landed on that dock, it's interesting that it may not have been 100% secure when the photo was taken. (Or I may be completely misinterpreting)

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 10/Jan/2012 16:31:21

    Unfortunately, we don't have a higher res than this one http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]. That poster is intriguing me too. Have queried with our Ephemera Dept. whether they have it or anything similar... Your point about where fire seems to be coming from is intriguing. Assuming that this is an absolutely genuine action shot, and not "posed" as sometimes is the case then that would imply danger from the waterfront...

  • profile

    Jo Hedwig Teeuwisse

    • 02/Feb/2012 02:21:39

    If someone could make a photo on that exact location I could make a mix with this old photo, like I've done with several others in my collection. Ghosts of war, one way traffic

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 02/Feb/2012 10:01:00

    Any Cork people, or anyone else, venturing to Passage West? Maybe you could help out http://www.flickr.com/photos/hab3045 with a modern day photo...

  • profile

    Jo Hedwig Teeuwisse

    • 02/Feb/2012 10:27:04

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland Feel free to suggest another photo from your collection, as long as I got one then and one now version I can mix and match. Doesn't HAVE to be this one :)

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 02/Feb/2012 11:06:54

    Crikey, there are just so many! If any of you excellent Flickroonies fancy helping out http://www.flickr.com/photos/hab3045 with a current photo to be mashed up with one of our older ones, we'd love to see the results...

  • profile

    GML35

    • 29/Feb/2012 20:50:11

    GML: Just came across this now. I'm from Passage West. I can get on the trail and get modern day picture for you. .

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 29/Feb/2012 21:58:23

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] That'd be really lovely of you! Thanks.

  • profile

    robin2066

    • 27/Jun/2014 12:11:09

    You have to waste less time to search your obligatory matter on web, because these days the searching ways of search engines are nice. That's why I found this article at this point.renters insurance

  • profile

    Hello Kitkat

    • 03/Sep/2014 09:29:22

    www.britishpathe.com/video/armoured-cars-1

  • profile

    TopCat 3

    • 08/May/2015 21:43:12

    There's another pic in the NLI collection of the same spot with no peerless, and with some Free State Soldiers in view. I will find and post soon. It is now on my page.

  • profile

    myheadismyonlyhouse

    • 30/Nov/2015 13:41:11

    right hand side map on the poster on the wall has a union jack superimposed on ireland..... here you go... www.the-saleroom.com/en-us/auction-catalogues/whytes/cata...

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 30/Nov/2015 22:17:04

    Thanks https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] - that explains it!

  • profile

    National Library of Ireland on The Commons

    • 11/Sep/2017 07:53:06

    I have just added this photo to our 50,000+ Views album. https://www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland/sets/72157651136879037

  • profile

    tomais1

    • 12/Sep/2019 10:38:19

    Another pic of the same location I posted here = www.dublinforum.net/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=600...