On track with Double Dutch
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Where: Leinster, Dublin City, Ireland
Try to find the spot where the photographer was standing.
When: 03 February 1962
Try to find the date or year when this image was made.
After yesterday’s exciting parallel searches for viaducts and castles we decided to get things back on track with an O’Dea image from 1962. A “New Dutch Engine” that looks a bit on the grim side, but was probably very efficient except on the hills?
Photographer: James P. O'Dea
Collection: O’Dea Photograph Collection
Date: 3 February 1962
NLI Ref.: ODEA 29/48
You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie
Source: Flickr Commons
Views: 9201
Photographer: James P. O'Dea
Collection: O’Dea Photograph Collection
Date: 3 February 1962
NLI Ref.: ODEA 29/48
You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie
Info:
Owner: National Library of Ireland on The CommonsSource: Flickr Commons
Views: 9201
jamespo’dea
o’deaphotographiccollection
nationallibraryofireland
locomotive
engine
dutchengine
1962
inchicore
railwayworks
deutz
deutzag
611class
motorenfabrikdeutz
córasiompairéireann
cie
erectingshop
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sharon.corbet
It might be "Deutz engine" rather than "Dutch Engine" - at least there’s a badge saying Deutz on them.
sharon.corbet
The Wikipedia page for the 611 Class says "The Córas Iompair Éireann 611 class locomotives were delivered from the manufacturers, Motorenfabrik Deutz at Cologne, Germany between December 1961 and February 1962, entering revenue earning service in the following August after receiving the new tan / black paint job at Inchicore."
Dr. Ilia
fantastic
sharon.corbet
I can’t quite make out the serial number of the first one, but here’s a key giving the correspondence between serial number and CIE engine number.
O Mac
Awaiting their black/tan paint job. flic.kr/p/2bmCXP1
cargeofg
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deutz_AG. Company still trading today and make a wide range of industrial engines.
cargeofg
www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/16897117365/in/photol...I am sure that IRPS have one of these locos in the main photo. Suckdiesel linked in a photo of it with it covers off before. If him or FredDeanSnr are along later we shall get more info.
suckindeesel
Well, location is one I should know well. It's the yard outside 'Diesel No. 1' workshop in Inchicore. Originally known as 'The Erecting Shop'. Before anybody gets too excited this was where steam locos were 'erected' in the old days.
John Spooner
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scorbet In 2018 I spent a night on a campsite near Rothenburg ob der Tauber. Also on the campsite were three small caravans towed by tractors. Another camper asked one of the three farmers what they were doing. Farmer: translated "We're meeting up with fellow enthusiasts on Saturday" Camper: "What, tractor enthusiasts?" Farmer: "Yes. The meet-up is near Würzburg. People coming from all the country." Camper: "Any sort of tractor?" Farmer: "No, only Deutz. Saturday is hesitates, laughs nervously Der Tag der Deutzen Einheit" Well I though it was funny. (A play on the similarity of deutsch and Deutz. Tag der deutschen Einheit = day of German unity, used to be June 17th, now October 3rd)
BeachcomberAustralia
3 February 1962 was a Saturday ...
sharon.corbet
[https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]] According to wikipedia, the Irish Traction Group has 3 of them, 617, 616 and 611. 613 has also been preserved, and like 617 is at Downpatrick & Co Down Railway.
Bernard Healy
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/ Looks like G613 on the side of the locomotive.
sharon.corbet
[https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardhealy] Yeah, but I'm still trying to identify the first one in line. [https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]] There are some more visible in the accompanying photo, including 611 and 612.
suckindeesel
The Downpatrick & Co. Down Rly www.downrail.co.uk/trains/ has preserved three of these locos, G611, G613 and G617. Looks like photo was taken before they entered service, note lack of livery and shipping labels on middle one. So, dates photo as Dec 1961 - Feb 1962. Serial nos: 57223–57229 They were underpowered and were later sold on to the Sugar Co. who used them as shunters. They were air cooled with an enormous duplex final drive chain. Had the 'pleasure' of riding on one out to Hazlehatch on a test run, achieving a heady 20 mph and nearly loosing the fillings in my teeth from the rattles and bumps. They did have a sexy name badge though, featuring a rocket of all things. Link to site relating serial nos. to loco nos. www.rangierdiesel.de/index.php?nav=1406282&lang=1
sharon.corbet
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] The photo is dated February 3rd 1962.
Foxglove
Thanks SuckDiesel for the link to DC rail, I am not a train enthusiast but even for the novice interested I was pegged. so much value out of a pic of an old dusty train.
robinparkes
Here is G617 at St. Magnus Halt on the Downpatrick and County Down Railway. www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/43839750884/in/album-7...
suckindeesel
[https://www.flickr.com/photos/scorbet] Yes, I missed that rather obvious clue. Deutz was founded by none other than Nicolaus Otto en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nicolaus_Otto
cargeofg
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] https://www.flickr.com/photos/scorbet Found where these locos had come up or were linked in before. Back to Peerless been unloaded a few weeks ago and 613 was in Wiki link photo re chain drives discussion.
Bernard Healy
https://www.flickr.com/photos/scorbet Apologies. I was on mobile & didn't twig where the 1st engine ended.
cargeofg
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] Other Deutz Locos on Flickr have had engine changes to Cummins power.
sharon.corbet
https://www.flickr.com/photos/bernardhealy I did the same initially myself! They're smaller engines than I was expecting.
suckindeesel
https://www.flickr.com/photos/beachcomberaustralia Saturday makes sense, as place looks deserted
derangedlemur
https://www.flickr.com/photos/johnspooner It's funny because every German tractor enthusiast knows the only true classic tractor is the Lanz Bulldog. Also, did you know, Rothenburg got the first automated car parking free spaces signs in Germany, in 1994? They helpfully informed the whole town that one car park had about 32000 cars in it because the counter counted a couple of them out twice and concluded there was -1 cars there.
suckindeesel
[https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]] That's interesting re engine changeout. The originals were rather underpowered and also air cooled. Probably spare parts became an issue in later times. Somebody in the preservation movement must have had considerable engineering resources to retrofit with Cummings. Here's a YouTube video of one on an outing youtu.be/smDDzskkJrk They were a bit before my time, but got to work on some when they were returned by the Sugar Co. for overhaul.
cargeofg
www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]/48138423697/in/photoli... No black and tan paint on this one looks like OE green.
John Spooner
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] I didn't know that about parkng in Rothenburg, but a car/Rothenburg connection I do know is that several scenes of the film Chitty Chitty Bang Bang were filmed there.
derangedlemur
https://www.flickr.com/photos/johnspooner There's a thing. I never knew that about chitty chitty bang bang. That'd be the same vintage as Charlie and the chocolate factory - also filmed in South Germany. It seems to have been a thing in those days.
sharon.corbet
https://www.flickr.com/photos/johnspooner https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] The only transport related Rothenburg fact I have is that it's a pain to get to by train, as it's on a small branch line and you need to change at the equivalent of Limerick Junction. It is a pretty little town though. (Also, I just learned that the German title of Chitty Chitty Bang Bang is Tschitti Tschitti Bäng Bäng.)
O Mac
It's missing a buffer. Missing buffer had four bolts and the not missing buffer is held on with six bolts... CIE must have done some in house buffer bolt upgrading post delivery.
cargeofg
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] Did not spot the different number of bolts. Would Deutz have removed them to reduce the length for shipping or they came supplied without them and CIE used a std in house part instead? Every other one and the other companion photo that https://www.flickr.com/photos/scorbet referenced have 6 bolt pattern buffers.
cargeofg
www.flickr.com/photos/carlobonari/3204510480/in/photolist... Had a quick look and all seem to have 4 bolt as this example.
suckindeesel
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] CIE would have fitted their own pattern of buffer, to operate with existing rolling stock. Probably shipped with Deutz's standard type, as shown in your photo. Buffers and couplers are normally specific too each railway to ensure interoperability.
suckindeesel
Mr. O'Dea seems to have liked this location, as several other photos show the same yard and also the interior of the building in background.
suckindeesel
[https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]] I dont think that the extra bolts are for buffer mounting as four is sufficient. Rather, these were countersunk bolts, part of the buffer assembly itself, and used to hold on its backplate. See catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000305258 showing delivery of different locos without buffers fitted but also with four mounting holes.
silverio10
Buenas fotos antiguas .