A distinguished gentleman in robes and chain of office sitting on a throne (of sorts)
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Where: Waterford, Ireland
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When: Unknown
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This fine Poole portrait portraying probably the Lord Mayor of a city to end this week. The robes and chain are very ornate and he is seated on a very finely carved chair - but who is he and what was the office he held?
Today's contributors, including sharon.corbet, Niall McAuley and guliolopez spotted the coat or arms, motto and regalia as those of Waterford - so clearly this is a Waterford mayor. Given that the catalogue date of the image was 1927, it was originally thought that maybe this was John J. Wyley - who was mayor that year. However, various clues didn't support that suggestion (not least the age of the man, the name of the person who comissioned the photo, and a "copy" label in the catalogue entry). There is therefore much stronger evidence that the mayor pictured is Henry Grainger, who was mayor in 1898. It seems likely a family member (probably a daughter) commissioned a copy from the Poole studio during the 1920s....
Photographer: A. H. Poole
Collection: Poole Photographic Studio, Waterford
Date: c.3 September 1927 (likely date earlier photo was copied. Original may date to c.1898)
NLI Ref: POOLEWP 3458
You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie
Source: Flickr Commons
Views: 20258
Today's contributors, including sharon.corbet, Niall McAuley and guliolopez spotted the coat or arms, motto and regalia as those of Waterford - so clearly this is a Waterford mayor. Given that the catalogue date of the image was 1927, it was originally thought that maybe this was John J. Wyley - who was mayor that year. However, various clues didn't support that suggestion (not least the age of the man, the name of the person who comissioned the photo, and a "copy" label in the catalogue entry). There is therefore much stronger evidence that the mayor pictured is Henry Grainger, who was mayor in 1898. It seems likely a family member (probably a daughter) commissioned a copy from the Poole studio during the 1920s....
Photographer: A. H. Poole
Collection: Poole Photographic Studio, Waterford
Date: c.3 September 1927 (likely date earlier photo was copied. Original may date to c.1898)
NLI Ref: POOLEWP 3458
You can also view this image, and many thousands of others, on the NLI’s catalogue at catalogue.nli.ie
Info:
Owner: National Library of Ireland on The CommonsSource: Flickr Commons
Views: 20258
ahpoole
arthurhenripoole
glassnegative
nationallibraryofireland
gentleman
chainofoffice
robes
fur
chair
throne
portrait
mayor
waterford
regalia
coatofarms
urbsintactamanetwaterfordia
motto
lions
wyley
grainger
henrygrainger
poolephotographiccollection
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Niall McAuley
I think we have seen that chain on Mayors of Waterford before...
Niall McAuley
Here is a different Mayor of Waterford wearing it: catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000591753 And here: catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000036845/Image?lookfor=http:...
guliolopez
One year later, and one mayor later. The previous image (below) is Edward Walsh (Mayor 1928-29). www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland/6061514031/ Which would likely make this portrait image John Wyley (Mayor 1926-27). At least according to Wikipedia and the NLI catalogue.
sharon.corbet
It also says "Waterford" above his head... (As part of the coat of arms and motto of Waterford City: "Urbs Intacta Manet Waterfordia")
Niall McAuley
wikipedia has a list, and suggests that in 1926 and 1927 the Mayor was John J. Wyley
Niall McAuley
There's a pic in the archive called Alderman John J. Wyley, Mayor of Wateford, 1926-1927, but it is not digitized: catalogue.nli.ie/Record/vtls000693352
Niall McAuley
In 1894, a John Wyley, grocer etc. was in business on Michael St waterford according to the Lennon Wylie site.
sharon.corbet
[https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley] Looking at the censuses, John Wyley of Michael St (60 in 1901) was dead by 1911. But his son, John J. was only 19 in 1911 making him 35ish in 1927.
Niall McAuley
On the chair - the arms on the back (with Lion and
UnicornFish?) are on the chain of office, too. The motto is the same today, Urbs Intacta manet Waterfordia. The cities arms have been simplified since, leaving out the Lions, and reverting to just the three ships, apparently an older form.Dún Laoghaire Micheál
Was a chap named Harold McMillan ever on the Waterford Council? media.liveauctiongroup.net/i/8165/9616809_1.jpg?v=8CCE2C6...
Niall McAuley
So, is this guy 35 and prematurely grey, or is the date wrong (in which case this is some other mayor). I see a few other shots commissioned by Miss Grainger dated 1894, 1900 direction... If a Mary with access to the physical archive could take a look at POOLEK 4746, a pic of Wyley as mayor, that would be great! {Edit - per notes below, I now think that this will not match Wyley, and it is the earlier Grainger).
sharon.corbet
https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley There was a Mayor Henry Grainger in 1898, who may be a relation of Miss Grainger. Possibly this was a copy made in 1927. ETA: Looking again at the Catalogue Entry, I found "Note in Poole Index Book: 'Copy'" under the notes section.
Niall McAuley
[https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]] Aha! that's interesting. here is Henry Grainger, Alderman of Waterford Corporation and Draper, 60 in 1901. So 58 in 1898 - seems like a better match. Miss Grainger would then be Catheline, Hannah, Molly/Mary or perhaps Ellia, depending on whether she ordered the original or the copy.
guliolopez
As per [https://www.flickr.com/photos/gnmcauley] and [https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]], I'm beginning to doubt this is Wyley also. [https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected]]'s Grainger theory seems all the more likely. One fairly firm clue to me is the chain of office. With each new office holder, a link was added to the chain. Normally with the arms of the new office holder. The chain worn here is much much shorter (fewer links) than the one we see in the 1928 image. Below. This (and the "copy" note, and the "Grainger" connection, and the seeming age mismatch) would all point towards a 1927 copy of an older image/earlier mayor... www.flickr.com/photos/nlireland/6061514031/
National Library of Ireland on The Commons
Excellent stuff. Incredible deductive powers on display again today. Have updated the description and mapped it to Waterford city hall (Indubitably!)
DannyM8
Henry Grainger, Obituary in the Irish times 21st Nov 1911, he died in Tramore he was a Draper in Barronstrand Street for many years.
O Mac
Buena serie de fotos antiguas